Housemark Grows 3,300+ Managements in 6 Years | Nat South - CEO

Vacancy under 1%. Rents still rising. Smart landlords win by running property like a business — and partnering with managers who move fast, communicate clearly, and protect returns.

In this episode, Casey sits down with Nat South, CEO of Housemark, to unpack how her team built 3,300+ managements organically and set a bold path to 10,000 doors without buying rent rolls.

Nat reveals the systems behind placing quality tenants fast, cutting vacancy risk, and resetting rents to market without losing great tenants. Discover:

• Pre-settlement access via agent and buyer’s agent partnerships
• Data-driven tenant matching that slashes downtime
• Education-first renewals that boost yield
• Service KPIs and 24-hour response times driving results

You’ll also learn how proactive investors grow equity faster through refinancing, renovations, insurance reviews, and smarter cash flow moves.

If you want to know why some portfolios glide while others grind, this episode gives you the playbook.

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Chapters

• 0:00 Market Heat And Vacancy Reality
• 2:30 Tenant Sourcing And Zero-Vacancy Tactics
• 6:30 Relationship Flywheel Behind Housemark’s Growth
• 11:40 Hold Versus Sell And The Cost Of Waiting
• 16:30 Running Portfolios Like Businesses
• 20:30 Service KPIs And Education-First Renewals
• 25:20 Vision, Leadership, And 10,000 Doors
• 31:00 Culture, Hiring For Character, And Growth

Transcript

SPEAKER_02: 0:00

Welcome back to another episode of the Tailored Property Wealth podcast. My name is Casey Taylor. I'm the host of the podcast. And we have a special guest joining us today, Nat South from Housemark. Nat has a wealth of experience in real estate. You've dabbled in some sales.

SPEAKER_01: 0:18

I have.

SPEAKER_02: 0:18

You've dabbled in business development roles and definitely dabbled in property management.

SPEAKER_03: 0:25

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02: 0:25

And you're the CEO of Housemark. Welcome.

SPEAKER_03: 0:29

Thank you.

SPEAKER_02: 0:33

How's the property management space at the moment?

SPEAKER_03: 0:36

The property management space, I always refer to it as the beast that doesn't sleep. So while sales slows down, buying slows down, finance kind of goes on to holiday for a period over the Christmas, property management continues to operate at a very fast pace. But the market is extremely strong. Across Brisbane, vacancy rates are sub 1%.

SPEAKER_02: 0:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 0:57

It's crazy. It's crazy. And we are heading into peak period. So, you know, the market is only going from strength to strength across our Gold Coast, Brisbane, Sunshine Coast, and the West locations.

SPEAKER_02: 1:08

Yep. And is there a certain area you think that's pumping more than others, or just across the board it's pumping?

SPEAKER_03: 1:14

I think just across the board, obviously the Gold Coast has seen phenomenal growth over the last couple of years. But on average, rents have increased, vacancy rates have tightened. So depending on the suburb, the tenant demographic and the time of year, that definitely impacts supply, demand, vacancy rates. But across the board, we are not having any issues securing tenants. And we're continuing to see rents increase.

SPEAKER_02: 1:40

Yeah. And that's just, I think that's just going to continue because vacancy rates are just going to continue to stay low with the it's a there's a rental crisis. And whether we're looking here, Brisbane, Goldie, Melbourne, across the board, it is tightly held in those good locations. So those rents will continue to increase, which is good for investors, right? But on the on the flip side, it is hard for tenants.

SPEAKER_03: 2:06

I think it does give us an opportunity to continue to work closer with the tenant community, though. When we do meet a great tenant at a property, but they've missed out because it's challenging for tenants in the current market. They're going to open homes after open homes and they're getting denied, but they're great tenants. And not because they haven't got good applications, but we can only move one tenant into a property. So I think it's a real opportunity in the market now for the right property management teams to work with the tenants that they are meeting and then utilize that in terms of that cross-pollination across other landlords' properties to make sure that we are placing the tenants into the right homes with the right landlords, which ultimately will result in increasing the landlord's return on investment and having really quality tenants in their properties.

SPEAKER_02: 2:49

Yeah, 100%. I think I saw you share, I don't know if it was on house market your personal this morning. I think it might have been another BA. Um, and you were able to secure a tenant for them. I think it was pre-market or off-market for that tenant. Yeah, absolutely. And it's just working the database, right?

SPEAKER_03: 3:04

Absolutely. Yeah. So that was a that we hadn't gone to market for that property. Um so purchase price was one point just over 1.3.

SPEAKER_01: 3:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 3:11

Um, rental return was a thousand and fifty on a 12-month lease. It's settled on the Wednesday and the tenant's moving in Friday.

SPEAKER_02: 3:18

Yeah, it's awesome.

SPEAKER_03: 3:19

So vacancy was next to non-existent. Now that's not normal.

SPEAKER_02: 3:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 3:22

Normally we need a little bit more turnaround time, but we had access prior working with the sales agent. And I think that's the other thing in the market as well, is having those relationships with buyers agents, with sales agents, with our partners that allows us to leverage access or prior at like prior to settlement to get better outcomes for our landlords.

SPEAKER_02: 3:43

Some of those special conditions you can put in a contract. We try and put it in a lot of the time. It's not always the case because there's so many different factors, right, going into each individual deal. But if you can get prior access and start to be proactive with some of those things, you just reduce that vacancy, right?

SPEAKER_03: 3:58

Definitely. And I think um case by case basis, like you said, if it's going to lose the deal, don't put the conditions in.

SPEAKER_02: 4:03

Yeah. Um, because it's the marketplace, right? Sometimes beggars can't be choosers, you've got to just take what you can get.

SPEAKER_03: 4:08

It's competitive. So don't lose the deal over it. But even if it's not in the contract, in the conditions, you don't ask, you don't get. So our team will happily ring the selling agent and if it's vacant specifically and chat to them. And even though maybe you haven't been able to put it in the conditions because of the seller, yeah, doesn't mean that we wouldn't have an existing relationship to then leverage to call and ask for a favor. So I think that's the beauty of, you know, our business has been built off relationships. You do the right thing, and that will come back tenfold. And then that helps everyone in that kind of ecosystem.

SPEAKER_02: 4:41

Yep. Touching on that, your relationships that you have with House Mark, you've got what, three, three thousand managements in six years? Yeah. What do you think has been key to building to 3,000 managements in six years?

SPEAKER_03: 4:58

That's a really great question, and one I get asked really often. So zero to we're at 3,300 now, and that's been organic growth. So our strategy isn't to acquire rent roles, it's to organically grow. And the secret to our success is relationships. Um, property management is such a challenging industry. It's undervalued, it's underqualified, it's been underpaid for a very long time. And we deal with people's properties and their problems. Like it is also sometimes not the most rewarding industry to work in.

SPEAKER_00: 5:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 5:29

But by turning it into a relationship-based property management business, we've really built strong strategic partners that recommend us and trust us. And that has given us that rather than going B to B, rather than going B to C, we go B2B. So we work with a business, a buyer's agent or someone in the sales space, and we do a really good job for them. And we trust them and we build a relationship with them and we do a great job for their clients. And then they continue to recommend us. Very much so like the relationship we have in that space. Like you know, if you send a client to us, there's nothing we won't do to make sure that client gets a 10 out of 10 outcome. And that's for the client, but it's also because of the relationship we have with you. And we're like that with all of our partners. And then that's because our business growth has been built on that, that's then rolled onto our culture and our property management team. So our whole structure in our business is built so our senior property managers can be relationship managers with our landlords.

SPEAKER_00: 6:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 6:28

They can pick up the phone, they can provide trusted advice, they can be available. We run a 24-hour response time. We respond to our landlords within 24 hours, and that's measured daily. And my PMs are phenomenal at it. Doesn't mean that there's not something that slips through the cracks. But 99% of the times, our landlords are getting really prompt, proactive communication, which is it doesn't only happen in the PM industry.

SPEAKER_02: 6:53

It's a hard industry to keep that level of service, I think. Because, like you touched on, it is it's a problem-based business, right? You're dealing with problems and finding solutions all the time, whether it be problems with tenants, problems with repairs, maintenance, all that sort of thing. So being on top of that is imperative to stand out.

SPEAKER_03: 7:10

And I think if if investing was easy, everyone would do it.

SPEAKER_02: 7:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 7:14

And I often say that to our first-time investors. Like you will at some stage look at your husband, look at your wife, and you'll go, why did we do this?

SPEAKER_00: 7:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 7:22

And I always talk like eyes up. The reason we did this was to build wealth. We're not doing this for short term, we're doing this for long term, Nat. 10, 20, 30 years down the track, you're going to look back and be grateful that you pushed through some of those more challenging situations.

SPEAKER_02: 7:36

100%. And you see some people who we see it with investors, sometimes it's like, nah, this is too hard when they give up and they might sell the property. And that's like, then they miss out on this growth, even in just a two, three year period, let alone once you're starting to talk decades, which is, yeah, it's powerful to hold on and just keep pushing through it, right?

SPEAKER_03: 7:55

Definitely. And I always say to our landlords, so we have an investment services department in our um business. And essentially that department there is there to help our landlords understand if there's any opportunity to buy, if they're looking at selling, why are they selling? You know, if they need to sell because their holding costs are too much, could we refinance them? If they um need a higher yield to purchase another property or increase equity, could we do a renovation to increase the rent? So we have a whole department dedicated to that. Now we don't buy, we don't sell, we only do property management. But that's when we go back to our trusted partners to say, hey, this landlord has, you know, 300K worth of equity in their property. They weren't usable equity, they weren't even aware they could, but they want to build their portfolio. So let's help them get from two to three. And we often talk to landlords and they want to sell just because they they've they've given up. It's too hard. And um, I always say to our landlord, you never regret the property you buy in the future, but you always regret the property you sell.

SPEAKER_02: 8:51

100%.

SPEAKER_03: 8:52

I look back on my first property in Logan. Should have held on to that bad boy. Like the prices have had substantial growth. Now, it got me from one to two, two to three, and it's been a journey. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 9:04

But like I look Stepping Stones.

SPEAKER_03: 9:06

Definitely. But I look back on that and I was like, why did I sell those properties?

SPEAKER_02: 9:09

Yeah. So um hindsight's a beautiful thing, isn't it? Yeah. I was only just saying to uh um someone yesterday that we were talking to about Logan and some certain suburbs like Woodridge, Slacks Creek, that have negative stigma still do. It's a nationwide stigma, a lot of people know. But five years ago they were under 300k and now they're selling seven, eight hundred K, right?

SPEAKER_03: 9:34

I just saw one sell of shit in Woodridge, 1.1 mil. Excuse me.

SPEAKER_02: 9:38

That's crazy.

SPEAKER_03: 9:40

Substantial.

SPEAKER_02: 9:41

Yeah. Yeah. So yeah. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. You just gotta hold on and get through those challenging times.

SPEAKER_03: 9:49

And get in the market.

SPEAKER_02: 9:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 9:51

Like there's never like waiting, when someone says to me, I'm waiting, I'm like, waiting for what?

SPEAKER_00: 9:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 9:57

Now is the time. Every time you wait, that property costs you more.

SPEAKER_00: 10:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 10:01

If we look back on prices five years ago when, you know, COVID versus what they are now, if we look back on rents five years ago versus what they are now, cost of living, everything has continued and will continue to increase. So when we wait, all that waiting does, I believe, is costs us more money.

SPEAKER_02: 10:18

100%. I say the more you delay, the more you pay. And then the more you pay, the more you have to go and borrow for the same asset. And like you said on rents, and we discussed rents earlier on, if you buy something five years ago, you're securing that lower price, but then you get your rental income increases year on year, your yield on that original purchase price increases. And then that's where all of a sudden you might be neutrally geared after a couple of years because of that growth. So you just got to hold on in those first couple of years and it it mitigates your risks, right?

SPEAKER_03: 10:47

And I think in those first couple coup in those first couple of years, also just making sure are you getting the right rent for your property? And I often, I often see our landlords be like, oh, you know, I want to look after the tenants. Absolutely look after your tenants, but you are still treating your portfolio like a business. 100%. So your rents need to meet market, and if they don't meet market, slightly under to retain good tenants. Make sure you're holding costs. People often don't review their home loans. Yeah. Yet interest rates go up and the bank aren't calling us to say, Matt, I've got a cheeky reduction for you. 100%. It's actually proactively looking at those, your insurances. Are they right, are they the right insurances? Is it a competitive price? So I think it's, you know, in those first couple of years, setting and forgetting isn't the right strategy. Having a property management team that drives your rent because it's a business, making sure your costs are as little as possible or as competitive as possible, making sure that you're maintaining your asset and looking at long-term solutions rather than band-aid fixes because there's going to be continuous maintenance at the property. Understanding that when you buy an older property, there is going to be maintenance and we need to have a little bit of a kiddie for it.

SPEAKER_02: 11:51

So I think that long-term approach.

SPEAKER_03: 11:54

Long-term and educating yourself as an investor can be really powerful. All of my first-time investors, I encourage them, I meet with them and I say, ask questions, learn. The more you know, the more you learn. Look at your end-of-month statement, make sure your invoices are right, look at your routine inspections, make sure your property's maintaining condition, review your exit report to make sure it's in line with when the tenant moved in. So I'm a really big believer. The more we educate ourselves as investors, the further we get in our property portfolio.

SPEAKER_02: 12:23

100%. It's like anything, right? It's business too. The more you educate yourself, or just anything in life, the more you educate yourself on that certain thing, you're going to continue to get better at it.

SPEAKER_00: 12:33

Definitely.

SPEAKER_02: 12:34

Yeah. You mentioned like one of your KPIs and turnarounds is like a response within 24 hours. What are some other KPIs that you either have in your business or you mindfully implemented in the business to stand out as a property manager to deliver that service to the landlords?

SPEAKER_03: 12:54

Absolutely. And I think we have a few key things and they're very similar across the business, whether it starts with growth, whether it moves through to property management or even our leadership team. And that is we are a relationship-based model. So in every role, that person needs to be doing whatever is most dollar productive to our organization goals, which is building relationships and our mission statements redefining properly managed. So that's getting back to landlords within 24 hours. That's building a relationship. Every lease renewal call starts with a phone call to educate the landlord around the rental market. Most property management companies send an email to the landlord and say, hey, we recommend this. And some I was talking to someone at lunch yesterday and they said they got a recommendation for a$10 increase. Nowhere is the market only have increased$10 in the last 12 months. And then on the flip side of that, if a landlord has overly zealous expectations on the market conditions, and I had one recently, an executive landlord wanted to increase the rent$250. Now, the executive market is strong, especially in this time of year, but we secured a premium price for that property when we first rented it. And they are good tenants, and the cost to relet that property is substantial. So just educating them on those numbers. So our whole model around the dollar productive task for each person in our business has been built off to drive service and communication and education to our landlords. Investment services is a massive point of difference for Housemark. No other property management agency in Queensland is helping their landlords strategically understand their portfolios and helping them navigate that direction. And we have a whole department committed to it. And then I think, you know, for us, property management only, we don't have sales supplementing us. There's no, there's no$10,000,$20,000,$30,000 dropping into our account for every sale or, you know, every buying, you know, whatever that looks like.

SPEAKER_02: 14:48

Yeah. It's not the side piece of the business, right?

SPEAKER_03: 14:50

It's our main focus. So if we don't have happy landlords, we don't have good rents and we don't have low vacancies, we don't have a business.

SPEAKER_00: 14:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 14:57

Um, which helps us have a better culture, helps us retain better staff. It helps us drive the leasing process really well. You know, that lease renewal process, industry average runs a 53.6 for NPS scoring. We run that at an 89.6.

SPEAKER_02: 15:13

So that's high.

SPEAKER_03: 15:14

But that's where we drive rents for our landlords and communicate, negotiate with our tenants and keep good tenants where necessary. So that property management only has been a really large contributing factor to our success with our partners, but also with our landlords because um they understand it's our main bread. It's not like I'm, you know, I'm a hands-on um CEO, I'm a hands-on business owner. I'm acting, I actually understand what the challenges are. I've been in, I've been a property manager myself. Now, believe me, my property managers are better at than me. They are like, I understand the day-to-day complications. And sometimes business owners disconnect with their PM department. It's a side business, saleswhat's actually brings the income.

SPEAKER_02: 15:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 15:57

And the property managers don't get the training, the support, the career progression. Industry average is eight months. And it's because they're not getting the support they need. Legislation changes.

SPEAKER_00: 16:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 16:08

Someone needs to roll out training and process on that. So I think that property management only component has been a very big contributing factor. And it's a big point of difference. It's why people choose us.

SPEAKER_02: 16:17

Yeah. I love that. I think there's a lot of agencies out there, we see it a little bit that they're just using their property management team almost as a database, right? So they can get those resales in the future. But everything in between, which is funny, you think you would nurture it and service that a lot better because your database would be stronger. They're just trying to get that resale in five, seven years' time, whatever the tenure is. Definitely. So I think that's important. Why do you think you mentioned that some property management just suggested$10 increase? Why do you think that is?

SPEAKER_03: 16:52

Because it's easier.

SPEAKER_02: 16:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 16:53

It's easier to keep the tenant on.

SPEAKER_02: 16:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 16:56

It's less negotiations. There's no vacate. There's no three letting. Unfortunately, it is easier. And and um and to that property manager's defense, no one's probably educated them on why they need to drive rents for their landlords.

SPEAKER_01: 17:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 17:11

Um, why they need to make sure that we are increasing those ROIs so that they can retain the properties. Um, they probably haven't been taught how to negotiate. So it's easier and that's why they do it. But in the defense of property management, they don't know, they don't know anything else. So our property managers have a specific process and we have a process around that lease renewal. And I believe they have a genuine understanding around why we do what we do.

SPEAKER_02: 17:37

This comes back, like you said, to that education piece and just having a holistic long-term vision of that, right? Because I think that is super valuable in the property management side of things. Because one, like you can get that education piece, you use a professional like a buyer's agent in the early stages, but as a property manager, there you're managing that property for a 10, 20, 30 year period. So that's just imperative to that long-term vision to be able to build a portfolio. Definitely have that value.

SPEAKER_03: 18:07

And I'm a real big believer in professional advice. Like I'm in the real estate industry and I run a property management business. I would engage a buyer's agent to purchase a property for me because they're specialists in what they do. They know the market, they know how to negotiate, they know the areas of growth, they know the difference between um investors, the rentals, renters in the property versus owner-occupied, and they're looking at those statistics. And the same when it comes to property management. You need a property management expert. And if you don't have that, it can be detriment to your investment journey.

SPEAKER_02: 18:37

Yeah, you're only as good as your team, right? Definitely. So you need to level that up wherever you can across that journey for sure. You were consulting to House Mark for a number of years. I was. And maybe what some of what you've already spoken about today is why you joined. But why did you join and decide to become CEO and and run the business ultimately?

SPEAKER_03: 19:02

Yeah, absolutely. So um, when I started consulting with House Mark, I had a two-year-old. I was pregnant. I had never had any intentions to being back in a business full time until the kids were in school. Um, but I started consulting at House Mark and Jonathan Bell's our managing director. And you've never met a mind like his. You've never met someone who can see opportunity, who um you can have a conversation with, and you walk away inspired time and time again. So meeting him and working alongside him and seeing what the vision was at House Mark, I couldn't say no. Now it took me a long time. Johnny chipped away, five hours, 10 hours, 20 hours, general manager. And then I, you know, had the opportunity to join the business in a, you know, a business owner capacity.

SPEAKER_00: 19:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 19:49

And would have I done it with any other business? No. I got offered. It was just this business, this vision, our mission. Like um, it gives me goosebumps. And I'm so passionate about it because the opportunity Johnny gave me is now my why as to why I do what I do at House Mark.

SPEAKER_00: 20:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 20:06

You know, I was a BDM on the tools for three and a half years, signed 900 managements, phenomenal what I learned and what I did there. But never did anyone show me that there was more on the table for me in that organization than a BDM. No leadership, no business owner. Um, there was no growth, no career planning. So that and that was all I knew because I'd done BDM for three and a half years. It wasn't until I started consulting and then met Johnny and he took me on this journey and kind of showed me what was possible.

SPEAKER_01: 20:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 20:34

Um, and he believed in me before I believed in me. Like he was like, Oh, you're the general manager. And I'm like, I'm not what do you mean? Then he's like, You're the CEO. And I was like, who's making me CEO? Like, and it was his belief in my skills and my capacity and what I could do with the business. Yeah. Um, and he supported me with that until I believed it enough myself.

SPEAKER_00: 20:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 20:52

And I think now for me, having that opportunity to do that with our team, you know, Nick DeRossa running our Gold Coast location, Jordan Slinger three years ago was a BDM at one of the top Ray White agencies, and he's now associate director in our Sunshine Coast location.

SPEAKER_00: 21:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 21:06

So being able to now pass that on to others was the why I said yes was because of Johnny's vision and what Housemark I knew had the capability to do. And gosh, is it a different business from when I joined at a thousand? Pure hard work and energy. That business has been built on. Now it's on process, it's on people, it's on relationships. Um, but he's ultimately why I said yes to joining the business. And now the people, now the people in the business and the opportunities we create are is what drives me every single day.

SPEAKER_02: 21:36

Yeah. I love that. And I think that's something as a business owner, and that's something I'm trying to get more work more towards is that vision. What he painted that vision for you. How did he paint that?

SPEAKER_03: 21:52

What he lived it, he breathed it, he said it, he showed it, he pieced it together. Like, and it's always been super, super clear. So our our mission statement or our vision at Housemark is to change the status quo in the property management industry. Now that's our that's our vision with our employees. So turning the ugly stepsister into the cool kid, helping property managers build a career, not a job, helping property managers earn north of$100,000, helping property managers be a mum, but also be flexible in that that approach. So that's how we have a very crystal clear vision. And we believe that everything starts with a crystal clear vision. And it doesn't matter what the vision is, but if everyone knows it, you're all heading in the same direction. And then for our um our landlords, our partners, it's redefining properly managed. So providing a level of service and a relationship in the industry that's not seen. And if we can do that, then we can naturally do this.

SPEAKER_02: 22:50

I love that. Leading into and some things you might be open to share, some things you might not want to. But what is the vision for housemark over the next few years? What's the plan, one of the goals?

SPEAKER_03: 23:01

Yeah, 10,000 properties under management.

SPEAKER_02: 23:04

It's 10,000. 10,000 properties under management. Is there a period in time you want to get to that, or that's just a long term we want to hit 10,000?

SPEAKER_03: 23:11

The one thing you've got to love about Johnny is whatever we can, whatever a business should be able to do in 10 years, he wants to do in three years, which I absolutely love him. It's one of the things that drives us, and it's like that why can't we mentality. So why can't we have 10,000 properties under management in the next three years?

SPEAKER_02: 23:26

I fucking love that.

SPEAKER_03: 23:28

It's just and I've like I've mapped it. It's actually, you know, I did I did a trip to Melbourne recently and I got pen and paper out and I mapped out, you know, we're at 3,300 now. What does 10,000 look like? And when you break it down across multiple locations, it's actually much more achievable. Someone hears 10,000 management in three years, which is a, you know, we need to increase our current rent role by over, you know, 6,000, 6,700. It's substantial. But when you break it down across our locations and where we want to go over the next three years, if you get the right people, it's definitely achievable.

SPEAKER_02: 24:03

Yeah. And I think once like you're at 3,000 in six years, you've kind of laid that foundation. You learned so much along the way. So you can just streamline that whole process to ramp it up and get those numbers right.

SPEAKER_03: 24:15

Absolutely. And it starts with the right person. So we got Jordan Slinger, he's the right person to lead our Sunshine Coast location. That's gone from zero to over 300 managements in 15 months. We've got Nick DeRosa leading our um Gold Coast location. That business is now north of 450. So it's about finding, like for me, someone says, Will you open an office in Newcastle? If I had the right operator, why can't we? Why not? Like it's all about the right people. So someone could ring me tomorrow and say, Hey, I want to open House Mark Ipswich, or I want to open House Mark Tourmore, or I want to open House Mark Sydney. And if they were the right operator that had a vision the same as ours, we'd we would support taking them on a journey from employee to business owner and open a new location with them. We've got the foundations, we've got the blueprint.

SPEAKER_02: 25:00

Yep. I love that. People are so important, right? And those right people in the business.

SPEAKER_03: 25:05

They're people are everything. Like I I often I hire for character, not for capability.

SPEAKER_01: 25:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 25:11

I can teach someone to be a really good property manager. It's it isn't the most complex role in terms of the day-to-day. Learn legislation, learn how to negotiate. But what I can't teach someone is to want to do the right thing by a landlord. What I can't teach someone is to understand the relationship that we have with you and how important that is and prioritize that in every action we do. So for me, I hire for character. Capability is important. And obviously, if the capability didn't come, then we'd need to reassess it. But for me, do I like this person? Can they build a relationship? Do they have good energy? Are they going to positively impact our landlords, our partners, and our culture?

SPEAKER_02: 25:50

Yeah. That proactive, happy to learn, happy to take on feedback and continue to grow. Definitely. Which is just part of the culture, right?

SPEAKER_03: 25:58

And that that delivers results. Poor culture, poor results. Good culture with the right leaders and the right process and the right vision.

SPEAKER_02: 26:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 26:06

There's no reason why your organization shouldn't have phenomenal results.

SPEAKER_02: 26:10

Yeah. What do you think in the culture what's important in culture? Not obviously systems, processes, there's different bits and pieces, but what are the what are some of the core things you find in culture that are important?

SPEAKER_03: 26:24

Definitely. Um there's a few things, that mentality. Property management is a very negative industry and there's a lot of limiting beliefs.

SPEAKER_00: 26:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 26:33

So why can't a property manager to why can't a property manager manage 200 landlords and be in office and be remunerated in according to that and have a team that supports them?

SPEAKER_00: 26:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 26:44

Why can't a business onboard 150 managements a month? Because those 150 managements then create more career progression and opportunity for us, for our senior property managers, to pay them more, teach them more, and have more opportunities in the office. So I think definitely that why can't we mentality and reducing those limiting beliefs? Like we do weekly training sessions and I did one and I was like, there's no budget, absolutely no budget, there's no limits. What would you change in the organization? What would we do? And we did one for tenants, landlords, our partners, and our employees. Now our employees want a doggy daycare and they want a budget for clothing and they want Medicare and they want all of these things. Why can't we have some of those things?

SPEAKER_00: 27:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 27:25

So, like that why can't we mentality and really having a collaborative approach? Like we have a rule at Housemark that if we want to change a process, not one person does it differently. We all do it differently. So we either all agree and it becomes part of the way we do things, or we don't agree and we chat that out and we're all happy with that. So I think that's that one vision, that one mission, we're all heading in the same direction. So I think your team, that that team aspect to thing is really important. And then a growth mentality.

SPEAKER_00: 27:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 27:53

So um growth fixes all problems. Let's continue to grow, let's continue to drive, let's continue to take risks, calculated risks.

SPEAKER_01: 28:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 28:02

But we've got so much knowledge now around what we've done over the last six years that when a property manager comes to me and says, Hey, Nat, can we try this? Well, absolutely, a property manager comes and says that they want to um start to onboard new business for a certain strategic partner. Absolutely. Um, and then the last thing is that relationship-based model. Like, you know, we're catching up for lunch today. And what we're doing right now is literally the pinnacle or the definition of our mission and vision with our partners.

SPEAKER_00: 28:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 28:30

You, me, Jack, and Brooke, our senior property manager, catching up for lunch.

SPEAKER_00: 28:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 28:35

And you know Brooke and Ella, of course. But and but we like you Brooke knows you and she wants to do a better job for your clients because she knows you and has a relationship with you. So, how do we bring property managers on a journey where they actually connect with you as a person, which means they connect more with their landlords, not have them sit at their desk and be out of the office doing in our 100 emails a day, like come to lunch, come on the journey, understand the why.

SPEAKER_02: 29:03

Yeah. And I think that I have the mindset that with your introductions to external businesses that you work with, that is an extension of your business. It's an extension of your service and finding those like-minded individuals as well. Because we build up trust with clients. Typically, we have a certain type of client and they go hand in hand with you as well, um, to be able to build that relationship, which is important. It's I think it's good you touched on like always wanting to like just because it's been done one way for 10 years does not mean that's how it has to continue. I worked in finance, um, I won't say the individual lenders, but they just had this mindset that it's been done like this for the last 20 years. This is how we're going to continue to do it. And it it's to that dollar productive versus non dollar productive. They're just doing everything and it's not productive. Don't work, it's not as efficient. So if you can create that structure and change things and always look to improve, I think it's so powerful.

SPEAKER_03: 30:07

I had someone come to me um a couple of days ago and they're like, Oh, yeah, but every other PM does it like this. And I was like, that is the exact reason. Yeah, now you've told me that, I can't do it that way. Yeah, exactly. Like that that's the I want to do it the opposite. The way everyone does things, I want to look at things differently and go, sure, what's the outcome? But just because that's how we've always gotten there, doesn't mean that's how we need to get there.

SPEAKER_02: 30:28

Yeah, 100%. It doesn't mean it's always the best way to do something, right? And sometimes you have to try things out and it might not work once you start to do it for a period of time and you might revert back or take little bits and pieces from it. What drives you to perform in this industry? It's a like we've said, it's a it's a problem-based business. There's always going to be problems. What drives you or motivates you? Because I think as we touched on off air, we have investors that sometimes put things in the too hard basket to invest in themselves. But you're out there, you're a mother, you're in business and you're kicking goals, you're driven with everything we've spoken about today. What drives you?

SPEAKER_03: 31:15

It's a really good question. I get off, like often get asked it. I am just someone, I let someone call, I had a lunch with someone recently and they said to me, What are your secrets to success? And when it comes to drive or why I do things, I always do the right thing. No matter who I'm dealing with, I just think even if there's not something I'm going to immediately get out of it, if I do the right thing, it'll get me really far in my career and it has. And then everything I do, I do to 150%. I'm an all or nothing type of gal. Like I do everything to the most absolute capacity I can. So when it comes to being a mum at home, I'd be my best version of a mum at home. When it comes to being a CEO, I would be my best version as I can as a leader. When it comes to negotiating an outcome for a landlord, I'll negotiate to my absolute best capacity. So I think what drives me is providing something to someone, whether it's my team, whether it's my kids, whether it's a partner or our landlords, that other people just think it's too hard. They don't go the extra mile. And for me, it's not even thinking about going the extra mile. It's it's like it's inbuilt in me that I just why like why wouldn't I do that for the client? You know, I spoke to someone recently and they're like, Nat, you know, the culture you're building in your organization is second to none. Your property manager, I was happy to post the keys, and my your property manager was like, no, I want to come and meet you. Let's go for coffee. Like that drives me to hear that. Like, let's continue to build that. So for me, um, there's no secrets to success for me. I wish there was. Um, but every single thing I've done, I've always done to the best of my ability and drives me to provide really good outcomes for people. And I've always said yes before I may be capable. I was a consultant who made like, no, I didn't get trained to be a consultant. I started speaking. I didn't get trained to be a speaker. I started presenting it, you know, I spoke at Aric, who like what gave me the right to be there? General manager, CEO, you know, becoming a mum. There's no you no one trains you to be a mum.

SPEAKER_00: 33:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 33:19

So just always saying yes to whatever opportunity, and you'll learn the skills along the way as well as long as you're willing to put in the hard work. And same with landlords. Say yes to the buy. As long as you can financially service it, say yes and go on the journey.

SPEAKER_02: 33:32

Work the shit out after.

SPEAKER_03: 33:34

You'll you'll learn along the way.

SPEAKER_02: 33:36

Yeah. I think that is a big mindset thing that not a lot of people have. Um, some people have told me I think I have it too. Sometimes you have to say yes, right. You have to take the action and you might not technically be ready for it. You might not have the experience or the accolades yet, but it's just that mindset of working it out on the way. Well, you'll learn it quicker. So 100%.

SPEAKER_03: 33:58

If you're working towards something and you've got time, you'll take your time. It's natural.

SPEAKER_00: 34:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 34:03

If you have no time and you have to be in that role, you will upskill quicker because otherwise you'll sink. So I think if you say yes, you will learn quicker and get there quicker than if you wait to have the skills to get there.

SPEAKER_02: 34:16

Yeah. It's almost creating an urgent deadline that's now, right? 100%. So you just have to you just level up and up your game, right?

SPEAKER_03: 34:24

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02: 34:24

Yeah. Love that. I think we're going to finish on that.

SPEAKER_03: 34:28

Perfect.

SPEAKER_02: 34:29

Thank you for coming on the podcast.

SPEAKER_03: 34:31

My absolute pleasure.

SPEAKER_02: 34:32

I think this one will be valuable to understand Housemark for, I guess, our investor clients who come on and we introduce them. But I think it's just a powerful episode to understand your mindset, your drive, and a lot of investors can take that on board or business owners that might be watching and be able to implement some of those things, whether it's in their portfolio or in business. So thank you for coming on.

SPEAKER_03: 34:55

Absolute pleasure. You said I'm going to be doing a lot of talking and you're going to ask a lot of questions. And I said I'd have no problem. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 35:00

But hopefully I've lived up to that. I think you have. I think you have. That was awesome. So thank you.

SPEAKER_03: 35:04

No worries.